Posted: May-06-2008 09:52AM

Don,

I lifted the picture off of the sports.racer.net site so don't know who, when or where.  It is a nice picture.

Sorry,

Randy McC

S&M Minis

Posted: May-06-2008 08:57AM

Cheleker,

You do realize that it was a mistake to admit to having the second edition of Staniforth's book?  I'll be contacting you about scans or copies of the two seater chapter!  I also have a later book by Straniforth on home building, but it was more generic, not Mini-specific.  Can't remember the title, it's in a box somewhere.  Those were good days.  Why let a total lack of skills and equipment get in your way?  Or the opinions of the "experts"?

This site has Asp and Landar listed, but no entries on the Asp.  http://sports.racer.net/index1.html  Go to the page on "Chassis".

Interesting how they all started to look the same, or at least similar: Asp, Landar and Unknown.

Randy McC

S&M Minis

Posted: May-06-2008 08:15AM

Don,

I'll give it a shot, or at least an update.  Steve had already posted pictures of this car on the Yahoo H-Mod board without much success.  I managed to identify the engine as a 997, to which Steve responded that it was his 997 engine - it didn't come with the car.  (Or actually his wife's 997.  My dream woman, has her own 997!)  Beyond that the logical Mini-based candidates were ruled out - Landar, etc.  On the Yahoo site Steve had a few additional pictures showing that the front end used Triumph spindles, standard ware for homebuilt and limited production sports racers and formula cars back in the day.  Steve's car also appears to have air shocks on the front end?

The pictures posted here on the MM board are better resolution than those on the Yahoo site and I'll see if the rear hub carriers look like anything available way back when - LeGrand, etc.

At the time of the H-Mod posting I advised that the back end looked like a Terrapin, a Mini based racer designed and built by Alan Stanniforth.  This was mainly due to the trapazoid shape of the rear bulkhead and the way the rear frame members have to accommodate the Mini bell housing, very Terrapin-ish.  I said I'd send Steve some scans from Staniforth's book, High Speed Low Cost published in 1969.  And then things ground to a halt when I couldn't find the book.  I got a little panicky because that book is in the "doesn't leave my house, so don't ask to borrow it" category.  I found the book recently (huge sigh of relief) so we'll pick up the Terrapin thread here. 

I'll acknowledge that I'm posting copyrighted photos here and will remove them if there's any concern.  The book is copyrighted to Alan Satniforth (Author) and Patrick Stephens Limited (Publisher).  I've left the photo credits on the pictures. 

Here's the back end of Steve's car and the Terrapin Mk. 2.

And here's the Terrapin Mk. 1 chassis with the frame pooched out to clear the Mini bell housing.

The Mk. 1 used diaphragm style bulkheads similar to Lotus practice and the Mk. 2 went to easier-to-build tube bulkheads.  Beyond that the similarities to Steve's car end.  The original Terrapins were intended as hillclimb cars rather than circuit racers and used as many Mini compnents as possible - steering rack and hub carriers in particular.   And the shape of the engine bay and trapazoid bulkhead may just be similar evolution to accommodate an oddly shaped engine/transmission package.  I believe there were a moderate number of Terrapin clones built by home-builders in England (Staniforth and several friends built the first two or three, IIRC) and the basic design concepts were probably adopted by hombuilders of non-Mini powered racers.  (I considered the Terrapin tube frame concept for a mid-engined Mini-bodied car I started but never finished.  But I decided to go semi-monocoque construction similar to the MG wasp that Sports Car Graphic did in 1965.  That 25 year old project car is up in the garage rafters about 80% finished, but it's way off topic here.)

The second edition of Staniforth's book has information and photos of a later Mark of the Terrapin that was a two-seat sports racer.  The concept was similar to the Lotus 18 single-seater becoming the 19 two-seater - keep the front and rear bays and widen the center bay.  What you can see of the frame of Steve's car ahead of the engine bay is reminiscent of the Terrapin two-seater.  I don't have that edition of the book but did photocopy the segments on the two seater verison.  So the search will continue for the 30-year old photocopies to see if the similarities are real! 

My guess is that Steve's car is a one-off that may or may not have some Terrapin influence.  I don't know if he's watching this thread, so I'll drop him an e-mail.  Some sources he might follow are: 1.) Contact Alan Satniforth.  He seemed to be keping track of the Terrapin clones and might know something about Steve's car.  He was also very active in the DIY home builder movement.  Staniforth still publishes in magazines reagularly and is fairly heavily involved in Formula SAE competition, so he should be easy to contact.  And 2.) Post the pictures on some message boards that get broader sports racer participation.  (No offense to the MM or H-Mod boards!)  I'll give Steve some suggestions.  Someone somewhere has a picture or some information on this car!  Mini powered sports racers weren't that thick on the ground.

Finally, Staniforth had a solution to the shift linkage dilemma that was so elegant and simple (relatively) that it fell into the "Well, duh!" category.  It involved rearranging the pieces of the Cooper remote linkage and changing the length of the rods.  True out-of-the-box thinking before tghe buzz phrase was coined.  (This was before rod change boxes.  I'm sure a little further out-of-the-box thinking would get it to work with a rod change.)  It was one piece of Terrapin technology that I carried over to my moncoque car.  More info. is available if Martin or others are interested.  I can't see any evidence of the shift linkage on Steve's car, Terrapin or otherwise.  In fact, in spite of the appearance of the bodywork on Steve's car, I wonder if it was ever finished and/or raced.  There's such a uniform layer of surface rust that it seems like no part of its was ever painted.  Tracking the history of a non-runner, now there's a challenge!

Regards,

Randy McC

S&M Minis

Posted: May-04-2008 05:55AM

It reminded me of the Asp, but appears not to be one.

http://www.minimarcos.org.uk/altpics/asp.html

I remember seeing an Asp at Road America racing back in the early 90's. Never saw it again.

Posted: May-02-2008 04:27PM

Bring it to Boise so's I can take a closer look!

I'd like to see the gear shift.

Martin.

My mind's made up - don't bother me with facts!

Posted: May-02-2008 04:26PM

Bring it to Boise so's I can take a closer look!

I'd like to seethe gear shift.

Martin.

My mind's made up - don't bother me with facts!

Posted: May-02-2008 10:41AM

geoO- the 997 is simply the engine the new owner had to check for fitment. Any A-series would fit, so it could be C-class too, based on the other info in your post.

--Spank 

Posted: May-02-2008 10:09AM

you might be able to find out more if you can find this book:

American Road Race Specials, 1934-70: Glory Days of Homebuilt Racers by Allan Girdler (Paperback - Jul 1990)

Posted: May-02-2008 09:33AM

Found another website where some guy in ohio bought one in 1986? from a guy in the same town I live in. Wierd.

Cranium
Inner and outer sills, left and right door steps, left-right-front-rear floors, and inner wings welded in place.  Moving to the boot area, then to the a-panels/front end.  Should have the welding done in 3 more years! :)

Battery Box removed, and rear valence removed.  Time to clean up the rust, and find the holes.

Posted: May-02-2008 09:04AM

At first blush I thought of Buckler. They used some BMC 4 cylinder lumps. It seems that no two Bucklers look alike. But they were mostly aluminum and front engined, not fiberglass and mid engined. The space frame looks right though. That's my guess anyway. Maybe a one off Formula Junior full body. No matter what it is it's worth saving. Best of luck in your search.

Cheers

Don

 " sometimes it's tougher to look than to leap "

Posted: May-02-2008 06:10AM Edited:  May-02-2008 06:26AM

Thanks,
steve steeb
stvstbsvc@netzero.com