| ACDodd |
| Total Posts: | 138 |
| Last Post: | 05-16-08 |
| User Since: | 03-22-02 |
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Posted: May-11-2008 09:00AM
 Edited: May-11-2008 09:04AM
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If you guys in the states have problem locating Mini friendly tuners, look at the address below for what some italian guys did in the same situation. They flew me to italy to set there engine up for them! I have used the 123 dizzies before also including megajolt. For your info with that spec I would start with curve 6. http://www.mlmotorsport.com/option,com_smf/Itemid,28/topic,1004.0.html AC
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| btsave |
| Total Posts: | 534 |
| Last Post: | 06-24-08 |
| User Since: | 04-21-02 |
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Posted: May-11-2008 08:04AM
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I hope it didn't come across as if I was bad mouthing the dizzy company! I wasn't. I would love to run the car on a dyno for set up, unfortunately, in my area (East coast florida), there are no, read that NONE, "experts" on mini's.... just mechanics who work on an assortment of cars. The only dyno I know about around here is a small set up in a local motorcycle shop. If anyone knows of someone with a dyno who would know how to set my engine up correctly, in my area, please let me know! Thanks! Bart "huh? did i really just say that out loud?"
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| declanm |
| Total Posts: | 191 |
| Last Post: | 07-07-08 |
| User Since: | 04-08-08 |
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Posted: May-11-2008 07:17AM
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if non-professional engine builders knew what their engine wanted, much less their VE, why the Hell would so many blindly buy Aldons? Your post fails to make that rather simple logical connection even after stating both ends of it. I wouldn't buy a "one size fits all" dizzy on a bet, but that doesn't mean others don't. That's much like buying a Weber and expecting it to be tailored to your engine. Madness ! The only way to evaluate a dizzy curve properly is to test it......on a chassis dyno. Very few non-professionals can predict what a given engine build will require before it is tested. Sure, they might guess and end up with a driveable curve, but what's the point in going to the trouble of building an engine just to make it drivable? If you want to have a sharp running engine, rather than one which is merely driveable, the engine must be tested by something other than the driver's derriere. But many folks in the U.S. think nothing of spending thousands on an engine build and then balking at spending another 100-200 on a chassis dyno session to get it tuned right. Then they badmouth the carb and dizzy manufacturers because their engine doesn't run the way they expect. Go figure.
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| 661100 |
| Total Posts: | 280 |
| Last Post: | 06-25-08 |
| User Since: | 02-24-03 |
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Posted: May-11-2008 06:59AM
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Hello Btsave, my 1275 engine has a 1300 GT header, rc40 exhaust, ported head with 1.46 intake valves, sw5 cam, dual hs2's, 9.75 cr on premium fuel. I started with a #5 setting and ended up with a #9 setting using the procedure of heading up a steep hill in third at the bottom at about 30 mph if it started pinging and i had to shift into second i would increase the setting. in the end it would go up the hill accelerating all the way with no need to down shift. this is in a "Non mini" with 12 inch tires and 3.65 final drive. Aaron http://community.webshots.com/user/66mg1100
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| btsave |
| Total Posts: | 534 |
| Last Post: | 06-24-08 |
| User Since: | 04-21-02 |
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Posted: May-11-2008 06:02AM
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That all makes sense, but, I would think that with a fairly stock 1275 engine, an HIF 1.75 single carb, running unleaded gas at sea level, the specs should be pretty "universal". I guess I was just looking for a starting point. Right now, the dizzy is set exactly as it came out of the box and the car runs with a VERY straight curve... The spec sheet doesn't address my specific mini, nor does the information sheets on the website. Also, WHERE is the adjustment gauge exactly? The instructions talk about it, but there are no pics as to where it is. My inner little voice does talk to me, but it curses more often than not so I have it sitting in a corner for timeout.  "huh? did i really just say that out loud?"
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| chichm |
| Total Posts: | 994 |
| Last Post: | 06-30-08 |
| User Since: | 02-20-00 |
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Posted: May-10-2008 08:02PM
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As a curve designer I cannot predict which curve your engine wants, but as an engine builder YOU should have a very good idea of what it will want. If you don't even know that, all I can do is make recommendations based on generalities. Nor can I specify that such and such a curve is suitable for 78-83% VE engines, because I do not know what your combustion chamber looks like, what fuel you are using, what altitude you are at, what swirl rate you designed in, and a dozen other parameters that make a difference to the advance your engine may want through the rev range.
As I said, only your engine can tell you what curve it likes. To home in on that curve means you have to possess the skill of understanding what your engine is telling you*, or you have to have a dyno operator with those skills. And it doesn't make a difference if you are dealing with a mechanical distributor, an electronic one (ie 123) or an open ECU: the engine tells you, you do not tell the engine. What the 123 is offering is a relatively simple way of changing curves without the expense and complexity of ECU's where you have to build your own map.
Sorry if this sounds like a non-answer or an avoidance of the answer you seek. The fact is, there is no panacea. You can buy an Aldon one-size-fits-all universal curve distributor if that makes you sleep comfortably at night knowing that the curve is exactly right because the package said so, but that wee voice is trying to tell you something just as much as your engine is. Learn to listen to it and you will both be much happier.
*Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance - more than just a silly book title, it's a life philosophy all car guys should learn
visit my world
www.starchak.ca also check out www.TDCperformance.ca
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| declanm |
| Total Posts: | 191 |
| Last Post: | 07-07-08 |
| User Since: | 04-08-08 |
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Posted: May-10-2008 04:44PM
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how is one supposed to determine their volumetric efficiency? I looked at thge advance curve graphs and there was no reference to VE except to mention that high tuned road engines or race engines have a higher VE. Duh! Did I miss a more specific reference to VE? A chassis dyno session would help one get close to what advance the engine wants, and the carb settings could be checked at the same time. Advance at the higher RPMs could be checked by temporarily reducing or increasing the initial static advance.
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| chichm |
| Total Posts: | 994 |
| Last Post: | 06-30-08 |
| User Since: | 02-20-00 |
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Posted: May-09-2008 08:40PM
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No one will be able to tell you what curve your engine needs, your engine needs to tell you what curve it likes. For guidance, go to www.tdcperformance.ca and look up the tuning guide. There you will find recommendations on where to start based on the volumetric efficiency of your engine.
visit my world
www.starchak.ca also check out www.TDCperformance.ca
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| declanm |
| Total Posts: | 191 |
| Last Post: | 07-07-08 |
| User Since: | 04-08-08 |
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Posted: May-09-2008 08:11PM
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if you know which Lucas distributor came out of the engine, you could try selecting a 123 curve that is similar to that Lucas. This site : http://www.starchak.ca/tech/pdfs/lucas.pdf may contain advance curve data for your Lucas. This article: http://www.starchak.ca/tech/pdfs/lucastuning.pdf may provide some insight. This article by Keith Calver: http://www.minimania.com/web/SCatagory/ELECTRICAL/DisplayType/Calver%27s%20Corner/DisplayID/748/ArticleV.cfm addresses advance curves in general for the A-series. This article, also by Keith Calver, http://www.minimania.com/web/SCatagory/ELECTRICAL/DisplayType/Calver%27s%20Corner/DisplayID/767/ArticleV.cfm addresses initial(static) advance
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| btsave |
| Total Posts: | 534 |
| Last Post: | 06-24-08 |
| User Since: | 04-21-02 |
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Posted: May-09-2008 05:44PM
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Have installed the 123 dizzy in my 1965 Mk1 Morris Mini Minor, running a 1275cc non-cooper engine, unfortunately, the manufacturer cannot advise me as to which curve to set the dizzy on. Anyone running this distrib. on a 1275 non-cooper? If so, how do you have it set up? Thanks! Bart "huh? did i really just say that out loud?"
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