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 Posted: May 12, 2017 08:13PM
Total posts: 11
Last post: May 14, 2017
Member since:Feb 26, 2017
Project update.

Ordered a new pair of driveshafts, but only installed the LH side due to the issue i was seeing.  All went well except for the new circlip breaking as i was trying to set it into the CV joint.  Thankfully had an extra from the other side and it went in as planned, along with the rest of the repair.

Engine on, put into reverse and she rolled out of the garage perfectly!  After getting backed out i went into 1st, was a little aggressive with the clutch, and she stopped rolling again.  Pissed...  At this point i suspected it was the CV spline connection again and surely it was.  But this time on the RH side.

With breaking the circlip earlier i'm now waiting for a new clip from MiniMania to do the RH driveshaft repair/install. Super frustrating to say the least.

Reflecting on the situation I feel this is too coincidental, and makes me wonder if the new CV joints for the 7.5" Disc upgrade have a alrger interior diameter than the driveshaft, or the spline count is off - i recall reading 18 vs 19 splines at one point in Mini history.

Anyway, friday night update.  Hope everyones looking forward to the wknd


 Posted: May 1, 2017 06:05PM
Total posts: 11
Last post: May 14, 2017
Member since:Feb 26, 2017
Just got done pulling some things apart and sure enough the driveshaft wasnt connected to the CV joint.  After cleaning things off, the circlip just fell apart in my hand as i took the grease of with a shop towel.  

And after inspecting the splines of the driveshaft theres clear inconsistency.  Im not sure if a few rounded edges would make it inoperable, but im going to play it safe and place an order tonight for some new shafts.

Also took another close look a the coupling on the driver side, its looking a little suspect so going to order a new pair of those sine have half of the work done accessing that point.

Let me know if there's anything else i should look out for, or replace now that im 2x invested into this part of the car.

 Posted: May 1, 2017 01:56PM
Total posts: 11
Last post: May 14, 2017
Member since:Feb 26, 2017
Hi there folks-

After calling on a dependable assistant, I was able to re-diagnose the issue with all your guidance and hypotheses in mind.

After all, the CV join isnt mating to the driveshaft on the driver side (LH).  And so based on that and the working of the differential, there's no rotation seen on the passenger side (RH).

Im going to pull the hub off tonight and inspect the joint, and even look to separate and re-set the connection.  


Ill give an update tomorrow night with what happens, because i am suspicious to a few other things:
- why no grinding between gears without clutch engaged
- why engine fan doesn't turn when in gear. Since its a CV issue, the driveshaft is turning while in gear and so shouldn't the engine/fan?
- noticed the stop nut (i think thats what its called) on the clutch arm isnt in contact in normal operation.  

 Posted: May 1, 2017 09:46AM
Total posts: 1210
Last post: May 27, 2017
Member since:Oct 8, 2013
This is a weird one as the OP says it drove in to change the hubs/disc's but wont drive out?But it appears the box/clutch has failed somewhere?

Mini's are like buses they come along in a bunch

 Posted: May 1, 2017 06:16AM
Total posts: 7009
Last post: May 20, 2017
Member since:Feb 7, 2006
A few other things come to mind.
Do you have a remote gearbox ? If so look down the rear of the engine and have someone shift the gears, there are two sets of linkages above the diff housing that should move freely when shifting.

Also the large nut that holds the final drive gear in place has been known to come loose if not torqued correctly and that will result in loss of drive. Has the gear box been apart recently ?

When you put it in gear and let out the clutch even though you are not moving does the speedo work ?

I would think the problem is a result of the drum to disc conversion but don't think there is anything you have missed unless your new cv's are faulty.

If in doubt, flat out . Colin Mc Rae MBE 1968-2007.

 Posted: Apr 30, 2017 09:31PM
Total posts: 1319
Last post: May 28, 2017
Member since:Oct 18, 2011
I would be looking carefully at the shift mechanism ....  With the gears moving, even at idle under no load, I would think there would be a bit of a crunch as you pulled the lever from first to second....("...I was able to run through 1-3 with the engine running and no clutch...").

If the output shafts ("...i noticed not even the U-Bolt coupling section was spinning at acceleration in first gear...") aren't turning with the car in gear then you have a major gearbox/clutch issue.....

... or the car is just sitting there in neutral while you waggle the (disconnected) gear lever...

Strange things can happen when you try to drive the wheels while the car is sitting on stands due to the excessive droop angle caused by the unsupported wheels.  So the first test would be to drop the car onto its wheels, stick it in first (engine off of course  and see if the engine tries to tun over as you push the car forward (it will be obvious if the car moves at all with the drag of the engine....)

Cheers, Ian

 Posted: Apr 30, 2017 06:00PM
Total posts: 1210
Last post: May 27, 2017
Member since:Oct 8, 2013
Your right if it was the Hub side you should see the shafts turning at least. are there no funny noises when it's in gear but not going anywhere? I can't see where this was driving and now not? It would seem to be something transmission related at this point either clutch or gearbox. 

Mini's are like buses they come along in a bunch

 Posted: Apr 30, 2017 05:39PM
Total posts: 11
Last post: May 14, 2017
Member since:Feb 26, 2017
Got it.  I used the old shafts with new CV joints since the larger diameter.

Let me ask though, even if there is a fault with the CV, shouldn't the coupling be rotating at least?  Power from the engine to the driveshaft, but then no wheel turn due to the CV?

Another thing that stops me from thinking its CV is the shifting.  I was able to run through 1-3 with the engine running and no clutch... they went into gear effortlessly

 Posted: Apr 30, 2017 04:46PM
Total posts: 1210
Last post: May 27, 2017
Member since:Oct 8, 2013
If it's rubber coupling type its nothing at the diff side it has to be in one of the hubs my guess is the shafts are not engaging in the CV's did you use your old shafts or ones that came with the Disc's?

Mini's are like buses they come along in a bunch

 Posted: Apr 30, 2017 04:35PM
Total posts: 11
Last post: May 14, 2017
Member since:Feb 26, 2017
@Minimans-

Yes it drove before the disc upgrade.  And the driveshaft is the rubber coupling type.  When installing the U-Bolts back on, i didnt notice any play in the coupling - as if i would have popped something out. But never know either...

Appreciate the time

 Posted: Apr 30, 2017 04:26PM
Total posts: 11
Last post: May 14, 2017
Member since:Feb 26, 2017
Thanks for the clarifying questions @spank.

1) Car in gear/engine running/release clutch = car does not move
2) Engine does run smoothly as if in neutral = yes
3) Pushing car (back or forward) in gear = no fan rotation
4) Clutch arm does extend and retract, doesnt appear to be stuck

I also dared to shift from neutral to first without the clutch pressed - hoping to get the grinding - but instead went into first without any problem.


@Specialist - i havent done the tear down to visually inspect the splines.  Might be next on the list

@BluBox - Sorry for vernacular.  Its not a Cooper, its a '68 Austin Mini

 Posted: Apr 30, 2017 04:21PM
Total posts: 1210
Last post: May 27, 2017
Member since:Oct 8, 2013
#1 did it drive before you swapped to disc's?

#2 what drive shafts are fitted? Rubber couplings, pot joints?

I'm thinking you have pot joints on the inner side and you've pulled it out of engagement of the splines when you did the swap?
I can't think of anything on the hub side that you could do wrong except not have the shaft fully engaged into the CV? Don't forget you only need one side to be disengaged to get a drive situation

Mini's are like buses they come along in a bunch

 Posted: Apr 30, 2017 03:49PM
Total posts: 1172
Last post: May 21, 2017
Member since:Feb 17, 2005
CA
Please clarify, are you calling your mini a Cooper. A 68 Cooper has disk brakes, as stock.

 Posted: Apr 30, 2017 02:44PM
 Edited:  May 1, 2017 08:17PM
Total posts: 725
Last post: May 29, 2017
Member since:Aug 9, 2016
Ok here's the final verdict... The drive shaft splines became dull and now slipping.    I can't be wrong.  I take pride of all of my advices, they're almost always 99.99% correct

 Posted: Apr 30, 2017 01:53PM
Total posts: 5798
Last post: May 27, 2017
Member since:Mar 9, 1999
clarification: you put car in gear, engine running, release clutch, and car doesn't move? Does engine rev freely in gear as if it were in neutral?

engine off. Push car forward (or backward). Does the engine rotate at all (look at fan position). 

is your clutch released or is the clutch arm stuck outward?

 Posted: Apr 30, 2017 01:03PM
Total posts: 11
Last post: May 14, 2017
Member since:Feb 26, 2017

Well, everything put back on as should and lowered to ground with no success.

Steps: 

- Put in reverse to back out, released clutch withstatic power = nothing. Accelerated = nothing.
- Put into first gear, released clutch with static power = nothing.  Accelerated = nothing.
- Turned off car.
- Kept in first gear, car rolled back two full wheel rotations.  Rolled forward same distance.  Noticed a few faint clicks.
- Put into second gear, ran the same exercise with same same faint clicks.

Thinking back to my possible points of error:
- removal and re-installation of drive shaft flange to rubber coupling.  Hand turns of the driveshaft?
- After flang reinstall, pushing the driveshaft in/out to ensure fitment.  Ruin something there?
- CV joint upgrade for the discs.  C-Clips and fitment went as described, but could i have missed something?


I can go to pull things back apart, but not sure what points i should inspect or look out for.  I dont think its a CV issue because i would think the driveshaft would have some sort of grinding or more noticeable noise issue when in gear.

I suspect its something with the differential or gearbox.  Neither of which do i know how i affected.

Help? Who wants to fly out to CO to work on this thing?

 Posted: Apr 30, 2017 09:35AM
Total posts: 7009
Last post: May 20, 2017
Member since:Feb 7, 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by ybenjamin
Yup, she's still wonder woman hanging in the air.  

I figured diff, but neither side is spinning. If one were to be a "default" would it be driver side? Passenger side (RH) barely made a quarter turn, while the driver side (LH) didnt move at all.

I was going to pull things apart but ill first give it a go on the ground. Thanks for the direction
From my experience the drivers side on a rhd car usually spins with the wheels in the air and in gear but when you replace a lot of parts there may be more drag on that side so it would transfer to the other side. Like Paul and you said put it on the ground and drive it.

If in doubt, flat out . Colin Mc Rae MBE 1968-2007.

 Posted: Apr 30, 2017 09:33AM
Total posts: 11
Last post: May 14, 2017
Member since:Feb 26, 2017
@specialist - i believe that photo is representative of a pot joint.  When upgrading my CV joint to the larger diameter for the discs, i only had to undo the flange from the rubber coupling which was easy to get back on after.

The only bearings i messed with where in the swivel hub, which i replaced with a new set of tapered timkens

 Posted: Apr 30, 2017 09:32AM
Total posts: 2048
Last post: May 26, 2017
Member since:Dec 1, 2002
Yet again specialist displays the true depth of his ignorance......

"How can anything bigger be mini?"

 Posted: Apr 30, 2017 09:02AM
 Edited:  Apr 30, 2017 10:51AM
Total posts: 725
Last post: May 29, 2017
Member since:Aug 9, 2016
-DELETED-



reason: no point to explain, because the OP didn't realize that a slight pull on the drive shaft will dislodge it from the pot joint and ball bearings will fall off one by one without him noticing it....anyway...

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